S3E5: Beyond the blend with Allied Alloys' Nidhi Turakhia

In today's episode, I'm joined by Nidhi Turakhia. Nidhi is the CEO and Partner at Allied Alloys and the Vice President at Titan Metals Corporation.

She has an MBA, a double bachelor's degree in Economics and Spanish, a real estate certificate,  and a yoga teaching certificate. There's not much Nidhi can't do!  

In today's episode, we talk about:

👉  Why blending is like baking a cake
👉  Data-driven decision making
👉  Relationships
👉  Being agile
👉  And more

Listen to the full episode. Wherever you stream your podcasts.

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WHO IS STU KAGAN ANYWAYS?

25 years in the metal recycling game and still learning and growing...

I learnt from the best and worked my way up from yard labourer to Executive Director of Trading and Operations for the largest metal recycler in sub-Saharan Africa. Responsible for 4,500 employees, 85 sites, and the overall profitability of a multi-billion dollar operation.

I brought my breadth and depth of knowledge to bear and co-founded the fastest growing, most-loved, and most awarded metal recycling company in New Zealand. No small feat in a country where people are outnumbered 4:1 by sheep (spoiler alert: sheep don’t produce much metal waste).

I thought it was time that tech worked for our industry, so I took all of my experience as an operator and trader and leveraged that to build THE killer scrap app, Buddy. That’s right - built for scrappies, by scrappies.

Father of two crazy-awesome boys. Husband to Lisa. Under 9 rugby coach. YPO member. Lifelong learner. Mentee. Mentor. Chief dog walker. Committed Stoic. Undefeated dance-off champion.


COME SAY HI ON LINKEDIN

https://www.linkedin.com/in/stukagan/
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Transcript

0:00

Hi, I'm Stu Kagan and welcome to Born Scrappy, the podcast for scrap metal exporters and traders. Join me in conversation with some of the most experienced traders and operators that have helped shape this incredible industry. In today's episode, I chat with Nidhi Turakia. Nidhi is the CEO and partner at Allied Alloys and the vice president at Titan Metals Corporation. She has an MBA, a double bachelor's degree in economics and Spanish. a real estate certificate, and a yoga teaching certificate. There's not much Neeti can't do. In today's episode, we talk about blending is like baking a cake, relationships, data driven decision making, separating your material, and so much more. So let's jump Neeti. But first, intro. Hey Nidhi, how are you? I'm good Stuart, how are you doing? I'm, uh, I'm always excited when I'm speaking to you. When I came to visit you the other day, just had a great time. So obviously excited to, to make this happen right now. And I'm, I'm think the next 40 minutes or so is going to be lots of fun. How are you doing? I think so. I think so. And I'm happy you were able to come visit us at Allied Alloys. So thank you. Yeah, you got a great operation, which straight away wanted to, you know, sit down and chat to you because you have been through so much. Um, and your company is, is very impressive. And I think a lot of people don't really understand or have any experience with the role that you play or that your company plays. So let's dive straight into it. So a couple of things, how did you land up recycling metal? What is your, your day to day look like as well now? So kind of the progression from there and then what you're doing now. Okay. No, great questions. Um, so I, I'm second generation. So pretty much was born into this industry. Um, yeah, exactly. Scraps is in my blood. Um, actually, uh, we were in a safety supervisor meeting just an hour ago and, and this story got brought up and they were just, they were like, poking at me and was like, they were, you were probably born on a sorting table. And I was like, Oh my God, you know? And so it's, it's a hundred percent of my blood. Um, and I. At first resisted joining this industry store. I'm being very honest with you. Um, I am a John Grisham fan. Um, so I thought I was going to be this criminal legal lawyer and like rock courtrooms and, uh, next thing you know, when I graduated from college in 2003, my dad gave me a proposal and was like, well, you know, you could do it. Join the business. If you don't like it within six months, I'll pay for your law school. And so I was like, that's pretty sweet deal. You know, six months getting paid my first salary. And if I don't like it, I can still go pursue my dreams of being a lawyer. Um, but never looked back. I ended up not going down that path and instead went and got my MBA and just dived in, like completely dived in since day one. And so here I am now, 21 years later. I started off as a brokerage person. So I was responsible for our export import logistics and documentation. And quickly from there went to being a trader, to handling industrial accounts and dealers to now currently CEO. So that's the first part of your question. Yeah. Yeah. That's what it looks like now. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, wow. Um, it's now, I will say now is. Probably one of the most exciting times that I experienced in my professional career, the day to day responsibilities and duties, honestly, at this level, very, as I mentioned, I mean, I just walked out of a safety and supervisor meeting where all my supervisors were poking at me, um, to like going out to the yard, you know, to check out our new catwalk in our new shark cage is what we call it for our turnings, crushing operation, um, to. Earlier today, you know, sitting with the C suite and executive levels on forecasting for October and now having this interview with you Sue. So day to day is very different, but it's. Just exciting and I love it. So there's a few things here. One is, um, how many people do I speak to that think that we're just going to join this industry for a few weeks or a few months? And then they've been in it for 20, 30 years. It's, it's so common. Um, I think we should all just bring in everybody we can and just, they just come for a couple of weeks and, and we'd have way more people, um, involved in the industry. I agree with that. So let's go recruit. Yeah, exactly. But so at the time of recording this right now for us, and this would be, you know, this will air in a week or two, you're forecasting for October, which means we're currently in the last, the end of September, but with this looming freight issue we have with the dock workers, how do you forecast? And I've been through it so many times. I, how do you actually sit with the C suite and go, well, this is what we're going to do next month, as long as we can get a container out, out the door. No, great question. And again, this is why, because of the IOH strike, this is why the forecasting meeting is taking place so later in the month, because we quickly had a pivot. Um, Allied Alloys, you know, being a stainless steel and high temp alloy processing company, we export quite a bit. To India, to Europe, to countries where aerospace is heavily being explored. Um, and so we, we have to pivot, right? Because right now we probably won't get our hands on containers until the strike is over. Um, so forecasting for us was just being as agile as possible. Um, I wish I could be sitting here telling you something different that I'm forecasting today for December, you know, that we're thinking of December and 2025. But still, as you know, in this industry, every day is different. Um, and it's hard. We just have to keep up. We have to keep up. Yeah, absolutely. And you have to stay ahead of whatever you possibly can, but, but then you get thrown strikes. And I mean, if we go back to COVID days, I remember having to sit with my board of directors and tell them what my predictions were. And I often sat in there and said. Well, if you can predict what the world is going to look like, what's the situation globally going to look like, I will then predict what the performance will be like in our company. Like it's extremely difficult. Um, but as long as you have people who sit in the C suite with you and on your board with you, that can kind of understand that, that's very, very helpful. No, absolutely. I mean, you know, what's the saying, the company is as strong as the team and the employees. So that's, that's exactly our life. Um, I cannot do this alone. A hundred percent. And that comes across in, in just coming to your site and coming on the drive with you in the golf cart and, um, going to see around and you knew everybody and everybody's just smiling and it was great to see, tell us a little bit about, because I don't think people understand necessarily what blenders do. I think that if I said to somebody, um, Nidhi from Allied Alloys, they're going to think that you're a melter of some sort. So can you give us a brief overview of what blenders do and what you guys specifically do? Oh, sure. I would love to. Um, so for me, the best analogy, blending is like baking a cake. So for example, common grades of stainless such as 304, 316, 201, 301 require a certain amount of nickel, chrome, moly, iron, other elements, and other units. Um, so we're blenders because we are able to exactly get that recipe correct. Um, so for 304, you need 8 percent nickel and 18 percent chrome. Typically, the balance is iron. You have to watch your copper, you know, your silicone and your sulfur and some of the other light elements. Um, and so we're able to produce a chemistry using various grades of metal that the outcome when they do go to a stainless steel mill and it is being melted, in baskets, you know, in furnaces that the outcome produces exactly what we said. So it will have as close to 8 percent nickel and as close to 18 percent chrome. So it's just like baking a cake. You gotta have the right amount of sugar, the right amount of flour, you know, and if it's a chocolate cake, the right amount of chocolate frosting, right? So that's how I look at it. Yeah, no, that's a great analogy. So are you guys buying, um, from metal recyclers as well as direct from source? Or how does, how does your blend come in? No, great question. Um, so we are not in the retail front, so there's no public business. We do not handle any cash on site. Um, we're only business to business and we purchase from dealers like myself and processors. We also purchase from industrial accounts. Um, and being in Texas, you know, oil and gas is huge, so we purchase a lot from the OCTG industry. And as I mentioned before, aerospace. Aerospace is a big one for us. Um, so yes, we do a mix of both. So let's now talk to the metal recyclers side of things. Um, what makes somebody a supplier for you? Who should be getting hold of you? If I have a metal recycling company, why would I be sending to you and not necessarily somebody else? And what are you looking for in your recyclers? Oh, wow. So that's two folded question. I'm going to answer the first part first. I will say, please get ahold of me, anybody, in any company that has stainless steel and nickel based alloys. If you have any of the elements that I mentioned earlier, when we're talking about lens, please give me a call because believe it or not, it ends up at my facility anyways. Um, I know, right. It's like, it's shocking to me too, to this day. It's like, you have all these phone calls and it's a small industry. We all know who we are. Um, and it's like, I get an offer from Tennessee and that same offer came now from Houston. And I'm just like, That material is going to end up in my yard anyways, because we're good at what we do. Yeah, a hundred percent. That makes a lot of sense. And what are the common issues that you deal with when you are getting material in? Right? Yours is more specific than a melter. Somebody I'm guessing says they're going to sell you one thing and another thing arrives. Is it a lack of knowledge? What is it? And what are the issues you deal with with supply? Um, I don't think it's a lack of knowledge. I think just because we're such a heavy oil production state, the material that you will see down here in the Southern region will be very different than what. The Northeast is producing. Um, so I don't think it's really a lack of knowledge. It's just the operations of the manufacturing change all of a sudden shifted. And so some common things that we see will be. Honestly, every recycler sees, right? It's like 3 or 4 contaminated with too much iron or too high copper. I mean, it's the boundaries that we all deal with on a low by low basis. Um, and so for me, I think it's not really the knowledge part, even though we do our best to educate our accounts. Like, Hey, you'll get more money if you separate your alloys. Um, it's more so what's happening in the entire industry in terms of the supply chain. Needy, where do you think you guys fit in where you make a real difference? So would you say buying the regular 304 from somebody or would it be really getting involved in the high nickel grades and things like that? Cause that's what you need to make a blend. You can't just get in all, you know, all the other grades. No, uh, great question. Um, I think we make a huge difference in the high temp side. Um, and that's part of our actual focus for 2025. We're talking about forecasting earlier, but our focus is to increase our high temp, um, part of the business. There's so much happening in. Science right now. New alloys are being I can't even say discover because they're being produced, right? Like things are changing at a very rapid pace. Thanks to technology. And so we're here to keep up. Um, so with space exploration and the growth that Asia's, you know, in India specifically is going through right now. We're just trying to stay ahead of the game and make sure we're positioned to supply that. Yeah, I, um, I went to the MRI last, uh, Oh, I think it would be this year, January, and it was absolutely fantastic. I mean, the way that event has grown. Um, and further in their cap, they've made it an exceptional event. It's a, it's a great event. I will be attending again in the beginning of next year. Um, if you haven't been and you're listening, I would recommend attending the MRII. India is where it's at. There is a lot of growth there. You know, you're already so well tapped in there. Um, but yeah, do you, do you go back there often or what do you do? I do. So I was actually born in India. I was born in Bombay or Mumbai and I moved here when I was only three months old. And so I still have family in India. And, uh, for me extra lucky, cause I have family and I have customers that are like family that I've known my entire life. So I try to go back to India at least once a year. I hope I'm going to be at MRAI because it would be super cool to explore India with you. Absolutely. So that's my goal. I'm trying to make it there for that conference and you're absolutely right. It's one of my favorites. Um, so I have attended it and I definitely recommend that. India's coming up quite. Absolutely. You mentioned aerospace. You spoke about science. What sort of trends are you seeing in your space in the recycling world at the moment? Is there certain demand that's growing? Do you foresee a demand growing in certain places? You're very much. Ear to the ground kind of person. Um, what's going on and what's coming down the line. So to answer your questions, do, and I'm going to do my best to answer it because of the different factors that are at play. Some of the things that come off the top of my head are just geopolitical events. Um, the election that's taking place right now here in the U S um, but if I had a crystal ball and if I had to make a bet, it would be on super outlays. I really think super outlays is going to be. increasing in demand, um, based on kind of the space exploration, what Elon Musk is doing. I mean, we read these articles every day and that's kind of where the world's heading to, is AI, um, whether or not we could actually live in Mars. I mean, it's, Sounds so outlandish because it is, but that's where we're at in the world. Self driving cars sounded crazy just five or 10 years ago. Exactly. I think, um, especially with the development of AI, I think everything is just going to speed up so much faster than we've ever had before. That, you know, if we're going to be going to Mars, it's going to be happening and it's 10 years. Um, there's no doubt in my mind. We're going to see some. Incredible things. We're in the beginning of it right now. AI is going to give us the power to supercharge all the developments that we're going to have in the future. So, um, whether it's. Sortation, right? I mean, we go back to recycling. I mean, the way that we're now able to start sorting our aluminum or any of the other products that are being sorted robotically, um, identification of commodities on a scale right now, you can grade robotically. I mean, like all these things are happening. Um, and they're just at the beginning. What we're going to see in the next year or two and down the line of that is going to be life altering, right? What we're going to see over the next few years is going to be, um, we probably can't imagine most of it to be honest. I mean, it's just going to be incubating right now, um, and starting to come to fruition over the next few years. And our industry is going to look very, very different. Yes. Um, because with all these development, like you say, all of a sudden there's going to be a need for different alloys as well, you know, yeah, these are going to be coming through, coming out and, um, they're going to be changing the industry as we know it. Absolutely. I think you used a very interesting word, um, incubating, which is so on point right now, because that is a period we're all in. I think just like probably all of us, there's a little bit of fear in me about what is on the other side. And if the right AI is already incorporated in all of our daily lives, and if that's going to take the right turn, because there's always a risk factor of it taking a bad one. But again, like we have to just stay ready for whatever the outcome is going to be. It's okay to be afraid. It's not okay to not do anything about it. I agree. I always use the analogy of my parents with the internet, right? In that era, if you know, they're, they're in their mid seventies, those that Rarely got stuck in and learned the internet, had very different careers and very different lifestyles at a later stage. You can not just sit scared now with AI and think, well, everything's going to change. Well, you need to change then as well, or at least learn, keep up with what's going on, um, because everybody else is going to come past you in your business, in your personal life, whatever it might be, you need to consider that growth is absolutely vital. Yep. I absolutely, a hundred percent agree. Let's go back into, let's go out of that world, back into metal recycling quickly. Um, let's, let me understand, what are your thoughts on how the relationships are evolving between melters and processes? And do you see that changing over time? Um, there's a lot of consolidation happening. There's a lot of movement specifically in the U S. Do you see big changes coming? Can you foresee anything happening in particular or, you know, is it just going to carry on the route it's on at the moment? I mean, I think just like the LME and, you know, just being a commodity that's heavily traded, I mean, this market ebbs and flows, right? We saw it during COVID, there was so many M& A's taking place and now we're seeing it again. I am very thankful for technology. I am very thankful for what AI is bringing us because it has, in a sense, made the world a lot more flat and a lot more transparent. So if anything, I think the relationships between melters and processors like myself are improving. Because both parties understand that they need each other. Uh, whereas maybe before it was like, you know, we always try to fly under the radar or we were hold our secrets close to our chest. Now it's like, no, I mean, it's out. Transparency is huge. It's a very good point. Um, and no one's ever brought that up before. That transparency is actually making our relationships better because it used to be that. You know, you used to have to get one over somebody and if you could sneak something or get some away with something, and that's how both parties would constantly look at the other. Well, they're not going to pay me in full or they're going to claim whatever, whatever it might be, or he's not going to, she's not going to pack the right material or they're going to try and get away with some, whatever, or miss their shipping dates. And then if the market moves, they're going to, that constantly is always in the back of our mind. And I wonder if. Due to the transparency, it's actually going to strengthen those relationships. It's a very good point, Nydia. I haven't heard that before. And I think that's excellent. Thank you. Thank you. I'm glad it was a unique point. I mean, I, I think it will. I think if you've looked just for the last five years, it already has. I mean, before it was like trying to join this elite country club. And the only way you could get in is if you, someone referred you or, you know, you had all this money to blow. Yeah. You know, but now it's, it's. Everyone knows everyone and it makes it a lot harder for someone to get one over or to screw another company over. Absolutely agree. 100%. I mean, you've got some incredible relationships when I was at your site and I put up a photo, um, everybody liked it and everybody commented and, Oh, Nettie, she's my favorite. And people absolutely love you. And I understand why, but can you think of a relationship or a collaboration that you had with A supplier where for whatever reason it's been really successful and how it came about and you know, what you learned from it. I can't pinpoint one supplier because honestly, all of them, you know, I mean, I can't just select one. I feel like that's what we're just, that's what we're good at. It's our reputation. It's the fact that we've always been successful. So behind our word, um, every business we conduct, it's with dignity. It's with elegance, you know, it's with grace and we really, truly value and care about our suppliers. Um, as CEO, Stuart, this is the best example I could give you. As CEO yesterday, I used chat GPT to quickly draft an email to my trading department to be like, Hey, Hurricane, Is hitting Florida. We have a lot of suppliers out there and the panhandle use this draft to reach out to them because it does matter. It's the fact that we care when taking that extra step to be like. We're here. If you need anything, Allied Allies will always open our doors to you guys. So, and we have during COVID. Yeah, that's, you know, that's fantastic. And that's a great attitude to have. And, and it's obviously worked for you guys because of the relationship. Do you feel that, or are there any stories you can think of where you, as a blender, you might desperately need some. Um, high nickel alloy or some material that you desperately need, that you feel that you would reach out to somebody and, and they always supply it to you, like a good collaboration or a good relationship, I think it's good for people to learn that you can actually have that in this industry. Oh my God. Yes, absolutely. I'm off the top of my head. If I have to name drop, I mean, CMC solid, solid, solid company. It's one of our top five suppliers in anytime we're in a pinch. It's just one phone call away. It's like, Hey, we really need this. Um, and CMC being publicly traded and just this large company, it's feels like a very at home neighborly relationship. I mean, cause of the friendship that we've developed throughout the years. Um, so that's one, if I had a name drop, but then at the same time, there's a mom and pop. Right. You've got like Beaumont iron and metal. You've got right scrap. I mean, you have South Coast Oak. I mean, there's all these companies that we're in it to win it. And we're in it together. That's amazing. I love it though. You're in it together because a lot of people think that if you're in it to win it, that means everybody else must lose. Cause there can only be one winner. And I think we often, especially me can relate, um, business. To sports, but what we forget is that you can't, you don't just have to have one winner in business. We can all win together. This entire industry can win by us, you know, increasing our presence and showing that we actually do fantastic things globally. Instead of us all hiding and trying to beat each other up and smash each other and, and, you know, make everybody else look bad by making other people look bad. You're making the entire industry look bad. You couldn't have said it better, Stu. I mean, it's all about collaboration, support, education, and awareness. Nidhi, you say I couldn't have said it better, but I'm pretty sure my wife will judge me, um, when she edits this and tell me that, well, you could have said it better. You could have said this, this, and this. We all have one of those people in our lives and we're better for that, by the way. It's very true. Absolutely. Someone's gotta, someone's gotta criticize us and edit us. My biggest critic, but also my biggest fan. There you go. So that's okay. What advice would you give, um, metal recyclers that are looking to build a long term successful relationship with yourselves or with a melter or whoever is, um, procuring material from them. Biggest advice I'm going to give this audience today is despite the technology and all the tools that we have, I still truly believe this industry is relationship based. So going out of your way, picking up the phone, making a phone call, meeting somebody face to face is a thousand times better than shooting off a text or sending an email. Um, because it all goes back to we were here, we're in it together. We support each other because we really care. Um, so just show that you care. And if you do that, I think you will be very successful. Yeah. I couldn't agree more. Um, relationships are the backbone of everything we do. Yeah. Um, you do have certain people that, although everybody says that you do have certain people that, um, row their own canoe and they try and it goes back to the old, they're trying to win and everybody else must lose. Um, but those are becoming. Few and far between at the moment, there's a way less of them than there are of everybody else who's jumping on the boat together and rowing in one direction. Um, and people need to feel the confidence or feel confident enough. To pick up a phone. I think if you go back 25 years, um, when I was getting started, well, there's no way we would pick up a phone and speak to another metal recycler to ask them, you know, what shredder did you purchase? And if you had any problems with such and such brand or have you sold to so and so before, and were there any sort of issues, whereas now you find that. You go to a conference and everybody's chatting, right? You can bring up any topic and people are willing to help you, you know, always talk about being hyper local and yeah, you might be competing and you are usually competing with the person next door. You may be, if you do street trade and things like that, but in general, as soon as you go a few miles away, you know, the metal's not going to travel that far. So you're not really competing with the majority of the market, even in your state, let alone in your country. So, um, Yeah. Relationships are key. I actually met with somebody just yesterday who's just got into the industry. Um, great guy and has an incredible business background and extremely successful and is just passionate about metal recycling. He got into it probably five or six years ago, reading about it, watching everything he could about it, and then decided now to buy, um, well, to start a metal recycling company. And he has zero relationships, right? He doesn't know anybody in the industry and he's never been to one of the conferences before, and I was saying, man, like, let me bring you like, come and meet everybody because I can imagine. I mean, Nita, you've been doing it all your life. I've been doing it for 20 years. Yeah, absolutely. And not just that, like, you don't realize that people are welcoming. You kind of think that, well, here I am in my own little place and, you know, everybody's going to fight with me and. But you come to Vegas or San Diego and next year, and all of a sudden there's seven, 8, 000 other recyclers. And it's like, people are happy to have a beer and talk about, especially when you're starting out as well. Like, Hey, let me tell you about the shredder. Oh, you got, you know, a third yard coming. Let me, you know, I can help you with what size shredder you should look at. Or if you're going to, and give me the pros and cons. I was explaining to him how that just opens up your eyes to this industry. And, and you wouldn't expect it until you get out, get out of your office, get out of your yard and actually get to these conferences. No, you're absolutely right. I mean, first of all, major props to you, Stu, for being that wingman or that mentor and walking him around and introducing him to people. Not a lot of people had that when we started, you know, I know, I know if I didn't have my dad, I probably would have been that one person standing awkwardly in a corner, you know, like, what do I do now? Yep. Um, cause it's intimidating. It is. Um, I mean, I remember being, you know, in my mid twenties and going to some BIRs and hanging out in the corner because I was going and I was the representative for the company and I had nobody, I didn't know anybody in those days and yeah, we had big volume and that was great and people wanted to wine and dine me because, you know, they could buy from, and that was fantastic and had lots of fun, but it was super intimidating to rock up there and there's no one, In, especially in those days, nobody's bringing you and putting you under their wing and saying, well, let me introduce you. And although I must tell you, and as we talk about now, things have changed. Like you can go to a conference. You can lock in with one or two people and they're super happy to introduce you to whoever they know. You know, it's not, I'm very much not trying to say that I'm amazing by introducing, I was just surprised that a new guy came into the industry. And I love it. I'm like, let's help this guy. We want the industry to do better. Like, how cool is that though? I haven't even stopped to think about it, but this guy's extremely successful, like doesn't have to work. And when I got to go see him. He was in the yard operating one of the pieces of equipment. He's just loving it. He's loving. Yeah. How cool is it? So, so we can attract people. We can attract people that are successful, people that are starting out, whatever it is. Um, and it could be something that we're doing. Like maybe it's because of the last five years, whatever, of, of having an impact on whether it's everybody on social media and trying to change the way people see us. But I think we need to keep going. Cause I think you're going to find a lot more people like that coming into the industry. Well, I, I mean, I, you hit on several points just now. I mean, I definitely think it is because we're all coming out of our shell shell. We're not flying under the radar anymore. We're being vocal about what we do, because let's be honest, we're the OG of going green, you know, I mean, we're, we're every single day we're making a difference for the planet, the environment, the economy. Um, so I'm amazed that this, um, gentleman that you're referring to jumped over, but it's not shocking. Hmm. I mean, I am, I'm like more people should they're missing out, like coming to our swimming pool. We're having more fun than anybody else. Like Chicago, I went to Chicago round tables and everybody's just having a great time. Like people all getting on and you know, it's a, it's a fantastic place to be, but let's go back to trying to add a bit of value where we can. Yeah. So yeah. Let's think about fluctuating markets because I mean, if we just go back the last few weeks, the last few months, it's been a roller coaster. So, I mean, you on the nickel side, if we go back a few more months and a few years, it's been wild. How do you manage that on your side? Um, are you locking in things? Are you hedging things? And then how do you then manage that on the buy side? Cause it's mainly the recyclers that are listening to this as well. Yeah. So, um, we do not hedge. We're, well, we hedge naturally, you know, as of like everybody else. But aside from that, um, we, we manage it because we're, we just, we're kept on our toes. I mean, I think all of us. Um, it's like, all right, every morning, what's nickel doing? Like we have a 15 minute meeting with the traders. Um, should we pull back our numbers or should we become aggressive? Um, it's just like any other commodity that's being traded. You just have to watch the market and make sure you're agile enough to move with it. Um, and lucky for Allied, we are because we're all Owner operated, we're all here every single day. Um, and so it's really easy for us to make quick decisions real time. Um, so on on the hedging part, I mean, that's in short my answer now. I mean, it translates to our buys and ourselves, we don't typically take long term contracts. The longest that we do is maybe a 3 month LTA. Um, and that's really for international consumers, um, but domestically, like same thing we're buying and selling real time. So when you're selling, it's a fixed price. You're not taking a percentage of the LME at all. Um, so when you take, would you then sell upfront and then buy against that? Oh, I don't know. And then when you have the right amount of volume, then sell it. No, both. We have, we do a combination of both. Um, I, we do it all the time. We will sell and buy against it. Um, there are certain contracts that it's a fixed price due. There's certain where it is tied to LME nickel, you know, chrome and moly. Um, so it just, it depends on who we're selling to, but because we have historical data and we know that these are the set of suppliers and consumers that we deal with. On a daily basis, it's really easy for us to kind of use that data to drive what's moving forward. How much do you rely on data? Cause I'm having this conversation a lot. And at the round tables, I was listening to George Adams talking about data and he was saying how if he could go back, what, or actually what he would tell an 18 year old, his 18 year old self today would be that. Get involved, understand data, understand how you can create the data, how to understand how you can utilize the data. He's lucky. He's got his sons, he said, in the business that are focused on that. How are you using data and where is it coming from? Oh, great question. Um, so where is it coming from? We have our own ERP system, um, that was built for Allied and it's called Plex. And so that is what manages all of our data. It's a hundred percent. Traceable, trackable, I know what material is being moved by who, at what time. I honestly, we probably couldn't have survived without that because it's inventory control, HR, accounting, all bundled into one. Very quickly, this team realized that data is extremely important for our survival. So I absolutely believe that data driven equals calculated risk. Right. I mean, without the data, you can't make a decision anymore, but I also agree with Mr. George Adams. I mean, I wish 25 years because right now we're revising how we do our costs, cost accounting and trying to, you know, get it all the way down to the department. So supervisors could be more in control and use that as a book of business. Um, and really take ownership. I wish I learned that 20 years ago, too. You know, so I agree with Mr. Adams, data is super important. What, how could a metal recycler add more value to their material before selling it to you? Physical addition. There's not really much you could do. I will say what you need to remove to make sure you get the right value. You know, just make sure the material is clean. It's not contaminated. Take the extra time and the step and the extra labor to actually segregate your alimony, you know, because dealing on the flip side where we're going straight to industrial accounts, um, we spent a lot of time educating them. We go onsite and we're like, this is why it's really important that you keep the 304 separate from 718, you know, because you're getting more value, right? So we're in return have to do less processing, less sorting, and we could pay you. Better. Um, so I mean, they don't know this though. They don't. Educating its source is vital and it's hugely beneficial because it's a uniform grade, usually going into one bin. Yep. Yep. So in short, I mean, I think just making sure your materials clean and segregated is the best thing to do. Last question before we get into some fun stuff. What do you wish every metal recycler knew about your business? We are USA owned and operated. All of the partners, including myself are on site Monday through Friday and Saturdays. And we are actually the top three stainless steel and nickel alloy processing company in the U S which well, really North America, which is huge. And a lot of people don't know that. And I think it's super important that people do. And if you sell us your material, I mean, we're going to give you great value, but also a really good relationship. Those are all really good points. They really are. Like, like the fact that you guys are, you know, owner run. Um, you're all involved in the business day to day on the ground and Saturdays as well. Yep. Um, yeah, that, that's great. That's a big differentiator and to know the size of you guys, that you're a real player as well. Yeah. Um, not just a friendly face, which you are, but actually a real player. So you're going to be able to, you know, if you are dealing with Nidhi and the team, you're going to also be able to source them. Some seriously good prices. So off of, off of recycling a little bit, although I guess it's touching on it. It always is. Um, who would you like to see next on Born Scrappy? And who's kind of, you know, who, who do you keep an eye on? Well, um, I would love to see my, my dear friend and the current president of, uh, Rima's Gulf Coast Reach and Becky Proller on here. Um, she's probably going to call me as soon as this gets aired and like, cuss me out for dropping her name, but that's okay, Becky, I still love you, so I would love to see Becky on this. Um, and who I always keep an eye on, oh, you've got to interview Alton from CMC if you have it. He's awesome. Yeah. I think those two would be my. My next recommendation is for you. I have chatted to Becky. Um, not sure it's going to happen. Yeah. I'll push now that I've got this, um, I'll push a bit harder. Yeah, exactly. I'll try. And, uh, yeah, I'll alternate. I speak a lot. So we, we, we're going to put something together with him. Let's get into getting to know you a little bit better. Do you have any favorite TV series or movie? Um, my favorite movie and I can watch this. Oh my God. I can watch it. Numerous times as a gentleman, the new one, the one that just dropped last year. I love that movie. That is, it was excellent. Excellent. Who's the director again? Oh my God. You know, I was just sitting here. Uh, Guy Ritchie. Guy Ritchie. Guy Ritchie. Guy Ritchie. Yeah. He's, he's brilliant. I love all his stuff. So yeah, great, great movie. Absolutely. I love it. It's, it's my favorite hands down. I thought it was actually the best. He's done so far. Wow. Yeah. It's a bit cool. Yeah. Have you got a favorite place to visit? Anywhere there's a beach. I'm not going to lie to you. Anywhere there's a beach and a body of water. Like I love Austin, Stu. I know you and I have talked about it because I could just spend a day at the lake. Um, so anywhere where I could get into a body of water and swim. I'm really happy. That's my happy place. You'd love the islands of New Zealand. Wherever you are, you're just around the corner from the beach. It's a very narrow beach. Country, so you can always just go either east or west and get to a beach very, very quickly. Fantastic place. So, um, I need to go. I haven't been yet. Beaches. Yeah. They're awesome. Big fan. Um, I grew up in Cape town, um, which is a big, big beach city. Okay. So, um, yeah, absolutely. I'm also a big fan. I'm quite an active relaxer. I don't know about you. I'm always constantly playing sports on the beach with my, my family. Um, I don't normally sit around and read for too long on the beach. Are you a relaxer and sitting on a chair all day? Absolutely not. I will. I think you and I, like just being scrappies, like we'll probably get bored. So no, I I'm, I'm extremely active. I'm either playing sports like sand volleyball or arm swimming. Like you won't catch me. It honestly, I don't even bring a book to the beach. What I always bring is my swim goggles. Okay, good to know never leave home without it. Yes. And Nidhi, have you got a favorite book? Oh, yes. There's one that I'm actually reading right now. And if you don't know it, but I definitely recommend it. It's about commodities and it's called The World is for Sale. The World for Sale. I know it well. I absolutely love it. Yeah, I read it about three times. It's a great commodity training book. If you haven't read it, you should read it. It's, um, very enjoyable. It's, it gives you a great understanding of how we are today and how things happened before. And, um, it's, it's, it's quite an exciting book. Um, and last thing is, have you got a favorite quote? I do. I'm not sure who quoted or who said this, but I'm going to turn it into what I think is the best version of it. And that is like, just every day, wake up tomorrow being better than you are today. I love it. Incremental growth. Yeah. Fantastic. Great way to end the episode and awesome episode. Nidhi, thank you so much. It's been awesome. Thank you. Thank you. Cheers. Cheers. Bye. Bye.